Vicious Rumors Family Tree

Metal Family Tree

This is a project aimed at making it easy to see who inspired the bands you love or even hate. For this I try not to use any influences that the band don’t claim themselves. There will be a focus on predecessors but successors will be added as they site the band. These trees become more and more interactive as new bands are added, allowing you to click any band that has a tree and jump to it.

We want our lists to be better. If you know something that belongs on this list, let us know. When in doubt we will leave it out, so we need reliable sources.

Vicious Rumors.jpg

Although the Bay Area is known for it’s thrash metal scene, Vicious Rumors were heavy metal. They are often considered part of The USPM scene. Guitarist Geoff Thorp has been the heart of the band since the beginning and drummer has been on ever album with the exception of one. The classic line up consisted of Mark McGee on guitar, Dave Star on bass, and on vocals Carl Albert. Starting in the mid 90’s the line up would be far less consistent. This family tree at this time will only focus on the classic line up. This is because I am unsure of writing credits after that point. If at a future point I have information on later line ups and respective writing credits I will revisit the VR family tree.

The Beatles are probably the worlds most influential rock band. Mark named them as an influence.

The Beatles are probably the worlds most influential rock band. Mark named them as an influence.

Steve Howe

Steve Howe most notably played in Yes and Asia as well as solo.  Mark named him as an influence.

Steve Howe most notably played in Yes and Asia as well as solo. Mark named him as an influence.

The Who are an inflectional rock band who ventured in to a harder sound at the time.  Mark named them as an influence.

The Who are an inflectional rock band who ventured in to a harder sound at the time. Mark named them as an influence.

Jimi Hendrix was easily the most influential guitar player in his day. Geoff named him as an early influence along with others that he first heard from his older sister.  Vinnie also named him as an influence.

Jimi Hendrix was easily the most influential guitar player in his day. Geoff named him as an early influence along with others that he first heard from his older sister. Vinnie also named him as an influence.

David Gilmour

David Gilmour was the long time guitarist of Pink Floyd and has done tons of stuff with other artists as well as solo albums.  Geoff named him as an influence.

David Gilmour was the long time guitarist of Pink Floyd and has done tons of stuff with other artists as well as solo albums. Geoff named him as an influence.

Aynsley Dunbar

Aynsley Dunbar is a drummer who has played with literally every band ever.  Larry named him as an influence.

Aynsley Dunbar is a drummer who has played with literally every band ever. Larry named him as an influence.

Jethro Tull were a progressive rock band most remembered for their frontman’s use of the flute.  Geoff named them as an early influence.

Jethro Tull were a progressive rock band most remembered for their frontman’s use of the flute. Geoff named them as an early influence.

Deep Purple were super influential to many. Larry named them as a band he idolized. Mark and Vinnie also named Ritchie as an influence.

Deep Purple were super influential to many. Larry named them as a band he idolized. Mark and Vinnie also named Ritchie as an influence.

Led Zeppelin are easily one of the most influential hard rock bands. Geoff named them as one of his influences growing up. Larry said Bonham was the reason he started drumming. Mark named Led Zep as an influence. Vinnie named Jimmy as an influence.

Led Zeppelin are easily one of the most influential hard rock bands. Geoff named them as one of his influences growing up. Larry said Bonham was the reason he started drumming. Mark named Led Zep as an influence. Vinnie named Jimmy as an influence.

Bill Bruford

Bill Bruford is a prog rock drummer who notably played with Yes and King Crimson.  Larry named him as an influence.

Bill Bruford is a prog rock drummer who notably played with Yes and King Crimson. Larry named him as an influence.

Yes were a influential progressive rock band.  Although they weren’t directly named as an influence, Larry named yes drummer Bill Bruford as an influence and Mark named guitarist Steve Howe as an influence.

Yes were a influential progressive rock band. Although they weren’t directly named as an influence, Larry named yes drummer Bill Bruford as an influence and Mark named guitarist Steve Howe as an influence.

Black Sabbath are the fathers of heavy metal. Geoff named them as an influence. Larry named them as a band he idolized.

Black Sabbath are the fathers of heavy metal. Geoff named them as an influence. Larry named them as a band he idolized.

Thin Lizzy have been a very influential hard rock band with their twin lead harmonies.  Dave named them as an influence and said that Phil Lynott is his favorite bassists.

Thin Lizzy have been a very influential hard rock band with their twin lead harmonies. Dave named them as an influence and said that Phil Lynott is his favorite bassists.

UFO are influential hard rockers. Dave named bassist Pete Way as one of his influences.

UFO are influential hard rockers. Dave named bassist Pete Way as one of his influences.

Neal Schon

Neal Schon has been part of a bunch but most notably Journey.  Geoff named him as an influence.

Neal Schon has been part of a bunch but most notably Journey. Geoff named him as an influence.

Billy Cobham is a influential jazz drummer.  Larry named him as an influence.

Billy Cobham is a influential jazz drummer. Larry named him as an influence.

Steve Hackett

Steve Hackett is a progressive rock guitarist best known for his work with Genesis and his solo albums.  Mark named him as an influence.

Steve Hackett is a progressive rock guitarist best known for his work with Genesis and his solo albums. Mark named him as an influence.

One of the great American blues based hard rock bands, Aerosmith.  Geoff named them as an influence growing up.

One of the great American blues based hard rock bands, Aerosmith. Geoff named them as an influence growing up.

Queen have been a big influence on many over the years especially guitarists and vocalists.  Mark named them as and and influence and Vinnie also named Brian May as an influence.

Queen have been a big influence on many over the years especially guitarists and vocalists. Mark named them as and and influence and Vinnie also named Brian May as an influence.

Judas Priest are one of the most important and influential metal bands. Geoff named them as an influence growing up. Dave named Ian Hill as one of his bass influences.

Judas Priest are one of the most important and influential metal bands. Geoff named them as an influence growing up. Dave named Ian Hill as one of his bass influences.

Kiss are one of the biggest american hard rock bands known for their great live shows (and also the face paint).  Dave named Gene as one of his bass influences.

Kiss are one of the biggest american hard rock bands known for their great live shows (and also the face paint). Dave named Gene as one of his bass influences.

Ted Nugent was an American hard rock guitar icon.  Geoff named him as an influence growing up.

Ted Nugent was an American hard rock guitar icon. Geoff named him as an influence growing up.

Terry Bozzio

Terry Bozzio is known for playing with Frank Zappa and having to many drums/cymbals.  Larry named him as an influence.

Terry Bozzio is known for playing with Frank Zappa and having to many drums/cymbals. Larry named him as an influence.

AC/DC became the quintessential hard rock band. Geoff named them as an influence. Mark also named Angus as an influence.

AC/DC became the quintessential hard rock band. Geoff named them as an influence. Mark also named Angus as an influence.

 

Randy Rhoads

Randy is best known for his two albums with Ozzy, however before that he two albums with Quit Riot. It was with Quit Riot Randy first made an impression on Geoff after seeing them play live.

Randy is best known for his two albums with Ozzy, however before that he two albums with Quit Riot. It was with Quit Riot Randy first made an impression on Geoff after seeing them play live.

 
One of the most influential metal bands, Iron Maiden came out of the NWOBHM movement. Geoff named them as an influence.

One of the most influential metal bands, Iron Maiden came out of the NWOBHM movement. Geoff named them as an influence.

Dimebag Darrel

Dimebag Darrel is the father of groove metal and was the heart of Pantera. Geoff named him as an influence although that would be a later influence since Geoff started playing years before Dime became known.

Dimebag Darrel is the father of groove metal and was the heart of Pantera. Geoff named him as an influence although that would be a later influence since Geoff started playing years before Dime became known.

Geoff talks about seeing The Runaways, Quit Riot (with Randy Roads), and Van Halen all before they became big. He said this really set a fire for him to take music seriously.

Geoff named Judas Priest, Led Zeppelin, and Black Sabbath as the main influences for Vicious Rumors.

Vinnie Moore played on the first album and wrote some on it. His influences include Jeff Beck, Ritchie Blackmore (Deep Purple), Jimmy Page (Led Zeppilin), and Brian May (Queen). Also Larry Carlton and Al DiMeola and later Joe Pass and Pat Martino. He said he started as a rock guy and got more into classical and jazz. When asked to name three musical hero he named Stevie Ray Vaughan, Jimi Hendrix, and Eddie Van Halen.

Dave Starr was the bassists on the first four VR albums. He started playing guitar before bass but switched when VR had trouble finding bass players. Dave says he’s a better guitar player than bassist. Some of his guitar influences are Glen Tipton, KK Downing, Scott Gorham, John Sykes, Gary Moore, Michael Schenker, Ace Frehley and Paul Stanley. He also names often names Savatage as one of his favorite bands.

Gary St. Pierre sung and wrote on the first album but I am unsure of his influences.

Jim Cassero and Mark Tate, guitars and vocals respectively, have writing credits on the first album but were no longer with the band when it was recorded.

Mark McGee also mentions being into bands like  Scorpions, Aerosmith, UFO, Rush, and Kiss when he was younger but didn’t name them directly as influences. He also mentions being influenced by 70’s pop.

Carl Albert sung and wrote with the classic line up doing four albums with VR. He tragically died in a car accident fairly young. I’m unsure of his influences.

Sources:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quqrn-lmq2o
http://www.knac.com/article.asp?ArticleID=5767
http://www.metal-temple.com/site/catalogues/entry/musicians/geoff_thorpe_vicious.htm
https://rockoverdose.gr/geoff-thorpe-vicious-rumors-rock-overdose-new-album-concussion-protocol-takes-ride/
https://www.vintageguitar.com/2920/vinnie-moore/
https://www.deanguitars.com/vinnie_moore_alt.php#:~:text=He%20is%20playing%20his%20Signature%20Dean%20guitar%20%26%20pickup.&text=Once%20Vinnie%20Moore%20picked%20up,%2C%20Deep%20Purple%2C%20and%20Queen.
http://wildestarr.com/bio_davestarr.htm
http://www.leviathanrecords.com/chasioads.htm
http://www.guitarsite.com/news/features/interview_with_wildestarrs_dave_starr/
https://musicmonstersandmuscle.wordpress.com/larry-howe-vicious-rumors/
https://www.ballbustermusic.com/2015/11/03/interview-drummer-larry-howe/
https://www.sonomanews.com/article/entertainment/sonoma-musician-spotlight-mark-mcgee/
http://hardrockhaven.net/online/2013/03/mark-mcgee-of-luvplanet-interview/
http://www.davesontour.com/interviews/m_mcgee.html

Avatar Family Tree

Metal Family Tree

This is a project aimed at making it easy to see who inspired the bands you love or even hate. For this I try not to use any influences that the band don’t claim themselves. There will be a focus on predecessors but successors will be added as they site the band. These trees become more and more interactive as new bands are added, allowing you to click any band that has a tree and jump to it.

We want our lists to be better. If you know something that belongs on this list, let us know. When in doubt we will leave it out, so we need reliable sources.

avatar.gif

Avatar has gained a lot of popularity over the years. They started with a very melodic death metal sound but since have evolved their sound becoming more mainstream but also less derivative from early pioneers of the genera. They have crafted a very eclectic sound. The band has had a consistent line up with only one change since the release of their first album. From that time the band consisted of vocalist Johannes Eckerström, Guitarist Jonas Jarlsby, bassist Henrik Sandelin, and drummer John Alfredsson. At that time the second guitarist was Simon Andersson, who was replaced by Tim Öhrström in 2011.
This list unfortunately is missing probably a lot of influences. In my research I was unable to find any interviews other than ones done by singer Johannes Eckerström. Fortunately he talks about band influences along with his personal ones but I’m sure the list is lacking important elements. This is one where I would really appreciate any sources that can improve this list. As I find more information it will be added. With that said, lets jump into what I have come up with so far.

Ludwig van Beethoven

 
The most famous of classical composers, Beethoven.  Johannes said he grew up listening to Beethoven because of his parents and this was his first musical influence.

The most famous of classical composers, Beethoven. Johannes said he grew up listening to Beethoven because of his parents and this was his first musical influence.

 
The Beatles pioneered rock music from the foundation set by rock n roll. Johannes mentions on many occasions growing up with his parents listening to The Beatles. He says they look to The Beatles in the way they put an album together.

The Beatles pioneered rock music from the foundation set by rock n roll. Johannes mentions on many occasions growing up with his parents listening to The Beatles. He says they look to The Beatles in the way they put an album together. Jonas talks about practicing “Day Tripper” when learning to play.

The Fathers of Heavy metal, Black Sabbath. Johannes in 2013 said the band was at a point where they are very riff focused and that comes from Sabbath.

The Fathers of Heavy metal, Black Sabbath. Johannes in 2013 said the band was at a point where they are very riff focused and that comes from Sabbath.

Hard Rock legends Thin Lizzy are known for their guitar harmonies.  Johannes said everyone in the band are fans.

Hard Rock legends Thin Lizzy are known for their guitar harmonies. Johannes said everyone in the band are fans.

Tom Waits

Singer Tom waits has an interesting blues based style but does some unusual things musically.  Johannes names him as a vocal influences.

Singer Tom waits has an interesting blues based style but does some unusual things musically. Johannes names him as a vocal influences.

Queen has been a very influential band over the years.  Tim mentions the band pulling influence from Queen.

Queen has been a very influential band over the years. Tim mentions the band pulling influence from Queen.

Kiss are one of the most famous hard rock bands. Tim named the main “God of Thunder” riff as the first he learned to play.

AC/DC are the quintessential hard rock band. Tim talks about practicing “Riff Raff” learning to play.

Van Halen were an extremely influential band. Tim said hearing “You Really Got Me” from Van Halen was the first thing that made him want to play guitar.

Iron Maiden are easily one of the most influential metal bands known for their harmonies. Johannes names them as an influence.

Iron Maiden are easily one of the most influential metal bands known for their harmonies. Johannes names them as an influence. Jonas named them as a important early influence and the band that made him want to play guitar.

Ozzy has put out some very influential albums especially earlier in his solo career. Johannes said he was a big influence when he was younger.

Ozzy has put out some very influential albums especially earlier in his solo career. Johannes said he was a big influence when he was younger.

Ministry were pioneers of industrial metal. Johannes names them as an influence.

Ministry were pioneers of industrial metal. Johannes names them as an influence.

Considered by many as the fathers of Power Metal, Helloween are hugely important. Johannes names singer Michael Kiske as an influence. He says after hearing Keeper of the Seven Keys pt 2 he got into music seriously.

Considered by many as the fathers of Power Metal, Helloween are hugely important. Johannes names singer Michael Kiske as an influence. He says after hearing Keeper of the Seven Keys pt 2 he got into music seriously.

Immolation are a old school death metal staple.  Johannes named Ross Dolan as a vocal influence.

Immolation are a old school death metal staple. Johannes named Ross Dolan as a vocal influence.

Blind Guardian are easily one of the most important power metal bands.  Hansi took vocal layering to a new level in metal and Johannes names him as an influence.

Blind Guardian are easily one of the most important power metal bands. Hansi took vocal layering to a new level in metal and Johannes names him as an influence.

Mike Patton

Mike Patton made his start in Faith No More before Mr. Bungle and other bands. Johannes named him as one of his biggest influences.

Mike Patton made his start in Faith No More before Mr. Bungle and other bands. Johannes named him as one of his biggest influences.

Pantera changed the world of metal when they released Cowboys From Hell. Tim is a huge fan of Dime.

Pantera changed the world of metal when they released Cowboys From Hell. Tim is a huge fan of Dime.

Cryptopsy are a brutal technical death metal band.  Johannes names their vocalist as a big influence.

Cryptopsy are a brutal technical death metal band. Johannes names their vocalist as a big influence.

In Flames were a melodic death pioneer before going in a…. different direction.  This influence is no surprise as Avatar’s musical career as mirrored their predecessors in way. Johannes said they were an influence especially early on.

In Flames were a melodic death pioneer before going in a…. different direction. This influence is no surprise as Avatar’s musical career as mirrored their predecessors in way. Johannes said they were an influence especially early on.

Marilyn Manson was a staple for edgie teens.  Johannes named him as an influence.

Marilyn Manson was a staple for edgie teens. Johannes named him as an influence.

Rammstein were huge in the 2000’s with their German industrial metal.  Johannes named them as an influence.

Rammstein were huge in the 2000’s with their German industrial metal. Johannes named them as an influence.

Strapping Young Lad, the band of influential Devin Townsend. Johannes named them as an influence and Devin Townsend as one of his favorite singers.

Strapping Young Lad, the band of influential Devin Townsend. Johannes named them as an influence and Devin Townsend as one of his favorite singers.

The Haunted formed out of the remains of melodic death pioneers, At The Gates.  Johannes frequently names them as a big influence.

The Haunted formed out of the remains of melodic death pioneers, At The Gates. Johannes frequently names them as a big influence. Jonas said they really taught him how to really riff.

Tim talked about Avatar being an influence on him before he was in the band.

Johannes has been vague with some influences naming “bands from Gothenburg where we are from, combined with the death metal scene of the late 80s/early 90s” He said he grew up with the music his parents listened to like Beethoven and then The Beatles. He also grew up with Guns n Roses and Kiss before later find German bands like Helloween. He called Michael Jackson a “musical genius and one of the greatest performers of all time”. He says he appreciates when actors sing because they know how to tell a story even if they aren’t the best singers. (He didn’t say if this includes William Shatner, but I hope it does). He says The Impaled was his first experience into the “fantasy” horror element but he wasn’t the biggest fan because of this he got into better bands like Carcass. He mentions borrowing a bunch of black metal but not liking a lot of it except Marduk.

Sources:

http://rockrevoltmagazine.com/interview-johannes-eckerstrom-avatar/
https://loudwire.com/remembering-dimebag-darrell-johannes-eckerstrom-avatar/
https://lotsofmuzic.weebly.com/home/one-day-in-avatar-country-our-interview-with-avatars-johannes-eckerstrom-and-a-reviewof-their-concert-in-toronto
https://myglobalmind.com/2016/12/10/interview-with-johannes-eckerstrom-lead-vocals-avatar-dublin-november-22nd-2016/
https://www.metalblast.net/interviews/the-last-laugh-an-interview-with-avatar/
https://mediamikes.com/2012/02/interview-with-avatars-johannes-eckerstrom/
https://www.loudersound.com/features/avatar-the-10-albums-that-changed-johannes-eckerstroems-life
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_mA7F2-wok